only if you don't have a check built in for your offense or some flag in you status bar saying it's ok to use. You could always put in clumsy, weakness/magic weakness. Stopping tree is kind of essential since it slows down their healing and at some point they're going to have to choose if they want focus, purge, or tree.
only if you don't have a check built in for your offense or some flag in you status bar saying it's ok to use. You could always put in clumsy, weakness/magic weakness. Stopping tree is kind of essential since it slows down their healing and at some point they're going to have to choose if they want focus, purge, or tree.
Maybe its just me, but I don't see many people outside the likes of Kyrock, Juran, Khizan, Azefel, and maybe one other name I'm drawing a blank on choosing anything. 99% percent of the player base probably just does AUTOCURING ON and never checks up, myself included. I might get the notion to work out some class by class work arounds with g-bot or even code my own, but not anytime soon I don't think. Especially since 99% of the people are all on the same playing field curing wise, as far as their lessons allow anyways.
only if you don't have a check built in for your offense or some flag in you status bar saying it's ok to use. You could always put in clumsy, weakness/magic weakness. Stopping tree is kind of essential since it slows down their healing and at some point they're going to have to choose if they want focus, purge, or tree.
Maybe its just me, but I don't see many people outside the likes of Kyrock, Juran, Khizan, Azefel, and maybe one other name I'm drawing a blank on choosing anything. 99% percent of the player base probably just does AUTOCURING ON and never checks up, myself included. I might get the notion to work out some class by class work arounds with g-bot or even code my own, but not anytime soon I don't think. Especially since 99% of the people are all on the same playing field curing wise, as far as their lessons allow anyways.
That's irrelevant though, and if anything helps the cause of the affliction classes by making the 'default' response more predictable. As long as you aren't hitting paralysis into cooldown, you're probably fine using it as early and as often as you want..
HIs point that at some point, against a fast enough affliction rate, you're locking out most of the main cures at once is spot on. In that situation, what you heal next is going to decide what options become available to you. It doesn't take a genius to prioritize herbs at least a little bit, autocuring was built to handle that.
If you truly never even check up on your healing, you just have to hope Garryn is watching out for you - and as good as I feel autocuring is at most things it still isn't a 'set and forget' mechanic any more than your offense is.
@Juran I wasn't trying to argue his point about locking out main cures at once. It was just a bit redundant to assume the majority of people are deciding what to cure to use next, instead of 'setting and forgetting' GBOT. Besides, once an affliction class has locked out the majority of your cures, the fight is pretty much done anyway. Unless you have some sort escape mechanic still available to you, which hopefully said affliction class would have accounted for via some sort of disabler.
Sure my comment was irrelevant to the current issue of infirmity, and the ongoing discussion about the finer diabolist mechanics. But it was something I felt like needed to be said.
The age of custom healing systems has passed, though it doesn't make yours, Khizan's, or any other name I mentioned or didn't mention any less relevant. It simply gives you a leg up in the healing aspect. But you are such a minority that custom healing systems aren't a requirement for combat anymore. Even more so coupled with the fact that its mainly a team combat game now. Requiring you to be more of a tank to outlast the damage long enough to become unhindered and participate, rather than an expert healer.
I expect anyone that fights to at some point in their career be able to manually prioritize ginger when fighting Hunters, to avoid being exploded via rupture 5s into the fight.
I expect anyone that fights to at some point in their career be able to identify masked recklessness and masked stupidity, to avoid dying to those afflictions needlessly.
Two very small over-rides. I was merely referring to the average player's tweaks, as opposed to those expected by Kyrock and like minded healers. I mean if you want to get down to the nitty gritty, prioritizing mana over health when fighting a cleric or likewise class is a manual override, but that simple alias to change the priority in no way shape or form compares to the specific situational decision process of your system or Kyrock's.
We are in the process of derailing this thread. I'll just conceed to whatever point you make next if any, so everyone can chime back in on why diabolist is good or bad.
I'm going to resurrect this thread because I feel I have something to add.
I've been using Diabolist class pretty extensively in 1v1 combat and my conclusion is that Diabolist has not adjusted well to the current meta with the changes to curseward, autocuring, and paralysis CD. I think the big issue that really holds the Diabolist profession back is an issue that Diabolist has had in the past but not as apparent as its affliction rate was fast enough to compensate for the problem. That problem is daegger hunt.
Daegger hunt has many problems. It lacks in-line envenoming which almost all affliction class benefits from. It is stopped by rebounding which the Diabolist has no reliable way to remove. Daegger hunt toxin giving is random, which makes it unreliable. Daegger hunt takes 3.6 sec balance as fast statpack which severely slows down Diabolist affliction rate.
I think the Diabolist class could use a reboot much akin to the changes made to Saboteur/Hunter/Outrider/Druid etc. But since those decisions are handled by the Garden and not by the players we must make do with what we have.
In my opinion, the best way to alter the Daegger hunt mechanic is to remove the balance on Daegger Hunt, give it an internal cooldown and have it deliver a toxin on hit on a short delay after the hunt action. It would make it function somewhat similar to wisp or astralwarp. It would give more control to the Diabolist and remove the randomness that makes the class frustrating. It will also allow for the Daegger to be envenomed inline.
Any thoughts, questions or comments on Daegger hunt or any other Diabolist mechanics would be very welcome.
I hate to be a jerk, but we told you so. We hit up most combinations of stat pack/animation and different strategies and it just doesn't pan out. The only way to debunk the 2006 bandwagon is to have as many people hit the wall as possible.
-Their affliction options leave a little bit to be desired. If you want to build the class around infirmity, you're going to need to give them a more evenly distribution of afflictions. Evileye itself is a pretty lackluster skillset. In Achaea, it was the bomb. In Achaea, they don't have purge. If it were me, I'd just reboot the class. Why? Stavenn doesn't -need- another affliction class. We've got two solid affliction classes and noctu can sub in as a decent affliction/support.
-Malignists could use a way to get 50% discernment or some mechanism to see what random curing like tree/purge/focus is healing on the victim.
-Deathaura (if you're not going to change it) needs to say "You afflicted Ahkan with chill."
-You should remove chill from deathaura for something you can use to infirmity.
-Infirmity cannot be used in deadeyes. Infirmity is a stare. This means you can't breach/infirmity. This makes the whole mechanic clunky and harder to pull off than it needs to be.
-If you're going to build the class around infirmity. Suggest some skills that do damage, mana damage, afflictions based on the number of skills. Think black ice.
-Wight/Lich is a catch 22. Wight's mana drain starts at 19 (i think) per stare. Each infirmity increases mana drain by 5. However, if you want to stick afflictions you're going to need to be in lich. Even then, it's a crap shoot, because you need that hunt to 1/3 your third afflicition in. However, if you're in lich, you're not going to be pressuring mana very well. Sure, you can drop out and sap, but you're not afflicting, so they can just run.
-Necromancy is in a good spot with death knights because dsl/engage is the bomb. Necromancy is pretty ho-hum for malignists and doesn't bring much to table. I'll take some glass cannon with the option to actually kill people. Deathaura is too slow and has no indicator of the affliction given. This does not help infirmity.
-Ourobori: These are less useful seraphs. Demon blast either sucks or is buggy as hell. (I've seen it blast someone out only to loop them back into my room). There's no seraph seek, aura, spiritwrack. There's no trade off to make them more useful here. They don't even get the seraph perk of not exhausting your mana on summon. If you want some wiggle room for malignist, make the ouboros more than just a catharsis-heal-bot.
-Nightmare is dead. There's no way to balance this skill with passive hellsight. Awesome. Make it do something else.
-The other demons: Why is there a limit? An outrider jacks out more afflictions than I dream of doing and they don't have a limit.
-Daegger hunt. Cool idea, outdated. When it's not bouncing off rebounding, it's hitting for 10 damage, 2 bleed 66% of the time. If I'm lucky, I get that 1 toxin in. I can't predict it. I can't plan around it. I just have to hope that it hits with hemotoxin when I land two more kelp affs. Since it's not 2006, paralyse deadeyes with a hemotoxin/iodine daegger isn't cutting it. Sorry, the thrill is gone.
What it boils down to is that Malignist was designed as an affliction overwhelm class. This was amazing when you could milk two afflictions in a nightmare and beat 99.5% of the game. Even ignoring the nightmare nerf, garrynbot pretty much killed the straight overwhelm affliction strategy. (Thank god). Sadly, malignist is still based on this paradigm, even with infirmity. Malignist doesn't fit in Imperian and is really the third wheel in Demonic. Other people do their job better than them. The only thing malig has going for it is sniping the occasional mana kill.
You need to be careful comparing it directly to seraph. No one wants to copy skills (unless it serves them. This won't serve them.)
There's a lot of room to build in more functionality (the seraph is more useful than the ouroboros). Things like terror and sear could become something else and you could push in a few passives, micromanagement abs, and skills through. To contradict myself, I'd classlead the following: Summoning my ouroboros shouldn't take me to 0 mana. If you want it to, my 600 mana ourobors better be the Dark Lord of the Ourobori.
I fought Iluv without pipes yesterday, and he still couldn't gain much traction at all(read couldn't stick a single infirmity). Sure things like epilepsy, hellsight, and such stuck throwing me off bal/eq all the time but the class still couldn't capitalize on it. The fight ended in a draw to much disappointment on both sides...As far as suggestions go for improving it, I'd agree with more oroubori help, the rest of the skills I know to little about to be in a position to declare one way or another, but they need a change in some form or fashion.
In a perfect world, Diabolist and Mage would see the next major overhaul of skills.
Comments
That's irrelevant though, and if anything helps the cause of the affliction classes by making the 'default' response more predictable. As long as you aren't hitting paralysis into cooldown, you're probably fine using it as early and as often as you want..
HIs point that at some point, against a fast enough affliction rate, you're locking out most of the main cures at once is spot on. In that situation, what you heal next is going to decide what options become available to you. It doesn't take a genius to prioritize herbs at least a little bit, autocuring was built to handle that.
If you truly never even check up on your healing, you just have to hope Garryn is watching out for you - and as good as I feel autocuring is at most things it still isn't a 'set and forget' mechanic any more than your offense is.
Sure my comment was irrelevant to the current issue of infirmity, and the ongoing discussion about the finer diabolist mechanics. But it was something I felt like needed to be said.
The age of custom healing systems has passed, though it doesn't make yours, Khizan's, or any other name I mentioned or didn't mention any less relevant. It simply gives you a leg up in the healing aspect. But you are such a minority that custom healing systems aren't a requirement for combat anymore. Even more so coupled with the fact that its mainly a team combat game now. Requiring you to be more of a tank to outlast the damage long enough to become unhindered and participate, rather than an expert healer.
I expect anyone that fights to at some point in their career be able to manually prioritize ginger when fighting Hunters, to avoid being exploded via rupture 5s into the fight.
I expect anyone that fights to at some point in their career be able to identify masked recklessness and masked stupidity, to avoid dying to those afflictions needlessly.
These are all manual overrides.
We are in the process of derailing this thread. I'll just conceed to whatever point you make next if any, so everyone can chime back in on why diabolist is good or bad.
-You should remove chill from deathaura for something you can use to infirmity.
-Infirmity cannot be used in deadeyes. Infirmity is a stare. This means you can't breach/infirmity. This makes the whole mechanic clunky and harder to pull off than it needs to be.
DPS-Caster plz.
In a perfect world, Diabolist and Mage would see the next major overhaul of skills.