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Galt ✭✭✭

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Galt
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  • Re: Improving Imperian

    Being considerate of concerns doesn't mean making any concessions or admitting that those concerns have any validity. 

    All it means is looking at those concerns (That, in some vague and ill defined way, entities will be 'abusive'), and trying to establish whether those concerns have any merit. In this case, yes - There's some validity to the concern, but it is not sufficient to justify hamstringing entities or allowing entire parts of the game to drive entities off and have no interaction with them. The game is not a collection of minor fiefdoms free to dictate which features they allow and which to ban. Organisations can no more forbid entities than they can PK or roleplay.

    If someone dislikes entities and doesn't want anything to do with them, fine. They can ignore them as much as they like. What they cannot do is try to be rid of them on behalf of others, be that by "banning" them from a city, or by being so obnoxious to entities that they quit. As I've said, I'd like to see entities have more power, because I feel that having orgs that players cannot control, and that's key here - that the orgs in question cannot be fully-fledged without an entity, that players can't sidestep the requirement - I believe that would be good for the game. It keeps things from being stagnant.

    OhmAnetteSarriusAodanWyll
  • Re: Improving Imperian

    Like Sarrius rightly mentions, you couldn't even have a sect without an entity originally.

    And this does feel like it's about control - players who can't even stand the thought of someone else, especially someone they can't PK, having control over anything their character is involved in. That attitude is not fun for everyone else and when it becomes too dominant in an org, it becomes toxic, irritating, and ultimately bad for that org and for the game as a whole because it permeates everything done in that org. It gets in the way of roleplay, it gets in the way of people doing anything that might upset the status quo and it favours stagnation. This is especially true when a vocal minority begin making the erroneous assumption that because their voice is the most noticeable one, that they must be right.

    If you can't handle other people having sway over your character in a roleplaying game then the problem isn't entities, it isn't sects, it isn't anything mechanical - The problem is you. 
    Aodan
  • Re: Improving Imperian

    My view on orgs, population, stagnancy etc:

    I believe the problem stems from allowing players to control all the orgs. This means that within a circle, there's little to no change or political movement, there's no real drive for roleplay-driven conflict and difference in ideology, etc. This used to be handled by orders - Being god-controlled, they acted as a counterpoint to the player run orgs, but they were also strictly optional. 

    This is part of why I believe that any sect or cult that invites an entity to attach should give up control entirely to that entity - As the system now works, despite protestations - And that the sect shouldn't get to remove them. We need orgs that players can't have control over, that have some influence on every circle, in order to keep things dynamic and stop things from getting stagnant. I think this has more to do with the lack of change and engagement in our cities and councils than anything. I'd also like to see more emphasis put on having an attached entity, such as a reduced number of max rituals learned for sects without it.




    SarriusAodanAlvettaOystir
  • Re: Improving Imperian

    Like I've said before, though - The simple solution to not wanting to be involved with entities is to not talk to them and avoid the sect/cult system.

    None of the bonuses or benefits of sects are so substantial that you need to be part of them to compete and you can ask other people to highfavour you. Most of all, don't try and push entities out of entire cities because you dislike them, as there are likely plenty of people in that city or council who do enjoy interacting with entities.

    You don't get to dictate whether an entire org in the game interacts with entities, just because you as a player don't want to.
    WyllAnetteAodan
  • Re: Improving Imperian

    The people opposed to entities existing and interacting with the game are a vocal minority and to frame it as those people being "shouted down" is ludicrous at best.

    It's clear from this thread that the actual large number of people - The actual, literal majority of voices in this argument - Like entities and want them to be supported and encouraged. The hilarious complaints that they "keep popping up in houses" and other attempts to frame everything entities do as somehow abusive or wrong is getting tiring, because frankly, other than a couple of minor instances of them using the peace room thing wrongly, nothing untoward has happened.


    AnetteZerinWyllLynyssaSarrius