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You forgot that you were chained by the third attempt.Kyraic said:
Second, it's not a huge deal because there's a pretty good chance of escape there.
You walk in, you throw down piety/ghands, they immediately try to run.
- ~33% of the time, they get out on their first attempt.
- ~56% of the time, they get out by their second attempt. (.66*.66= .4356 chance to fail both moves, meaning ~%56 chance to escape.
- 0.66*0.66*0.66=0.287496 chance to fail three moves in a row. ~%71 chance to escape by three moves.
Kinda my take as well. I think it would benefit greatly from just allowing haste to be self targetted to an appropriate balance level and trade off for likely damage level or finisher thresholds.Sarrius said:So, I think we need to talk about Berserkers. Usually, I'd put this in its own thread, but Engineer is clearly more important than our current professions actually working, so I guess this will just become a classlead concern anyways. Last night, I used a mirror to copy Tahm and toy around with the class. It was one of the professions I'm entertaining picking up to revitalize my interest in the game. After looking at the hard numbers, I can't for one minute justify spending any credits or lessons on this class.
It might be a 'team fight king' just because of WARCHANTS HASTE and their ability to work with others, but we need to analyze the actual state of the class here. From everything I can see, the class is still stuck in the era where it was solely Anti-Magick. It operates under the assumption that an Outrider will be there. It actually has been designed entirely dependent on the ecosystem of Anti-Magick, never once having a consideration that a Berserker might go and do his own thing or not have a team around to play with. I want to talk about some of the problems I've identified just looking at this data.
1. Lots of bleeding synergy, but not a lot of ways to push the theme : Berserkers come with a lot of things that care about bleeding, but their actual ability to take advantage of this is sort of bottlenecked. They possess Bloodlet in Maiming, which does not deliver a toxin and has a soft cap, as well as Bleed in Warchants, which has no soft cap.. but the nature of the skill means it pushes the Bloodlet softcap. These would be their enablers, and they are few and far between. However, they have payoff skills for this bleeding - Warchants Vesselburst (deals damage based on bleeding - looks like roughly BLEEDING*2.5=RESULTANT_DMG - this is a Psychic Bloodfreeze, basically) and Warchants Bloodflow which, from my testing, I needed somewhere around 21 to 30 bleeding based on 460maxHP, to get haemophilia to trigger. Basically, Berserkers lack a way to take advantage of this avenue due to the nature of their bleeding skills. They don't just generate a bunch of bleeding like Outriders might while pushing their normal offense. They need somebody else pushing the bleeding because they won't stick haemo. Finally, this might seem small, but they have no way to accurate get a readout on bleeding themselves - an Outrider has WYRMRIDING BLOODSCENT, which gives them a readout on all bleeding when it occurs. Berserkers seem like a class that truly want this, and it could have been built in to WARCHANTS RAGE or even as a separate defense elsewhere. In addition, for Bleeding being such a core theme in their design, they sure seem to be lacking a Shield skill in Maiming to generate bleeding or act similar to Batter, Bash, and Smash.
2. They sure have a lot of closers, payoffs, and unique buffs, but no way to get to them alone : I am referring to Maiming Batter, Bash, and Smash, as well as Warchants Pierce and Bewilder. Berserker rewards having a set list of afflictions present on the target, some of which cannot be tracked with any true reliability and some of which do not come from toxins. Pierce scales on Weaken's aff list, of which two are not available in any way aside from Warchant Weaken or help.
3. Their numbers are just all wrong - they scale like **** and they're about as slow : I'll be upfront here: the shield attacks that a Berserker performs are by far the biggest gate on their offense, clocking in at 2.9s with a Level 1 Balance bonus and a Level 3 Shield. Warchant balance is faster than 2.9s, but you cannot perform another Warchant until you regain full balance. This means that the speed at which Berserker combos come out at is roughly 2.9s or slower. It feels like this would take too much time to build up to your specialty shield hits - in the time you would use to stick all of this, your opponent definitely isn't sitting still. They've likely worked their way to their own kill condition too. If this wasn't bad enough, their damage is terrible by all accounts. They deal physical damage on all accounts, even Warchant damage. Maiming damage is not particularly high due to Blunt and Cutting resists being so easy to stack up. Warchant's Psychic type is still blocked by surcoat due to physical sourcing, and can be reduced by class defenses, Philosophy, and the psychic resist ring. Pierce's scaling seems to be in the ballpark of roughly 4% extra maxHP in damage per aff, topping out at ~19% of maxHP with all affs. The totals at which they deal damage feel very stunted, making it hard to lead up to Overwhelm - a skill that would make Shout do roughly 9.3% of maxHP for the duration. Their **** damage means that Warchants Shatter is only going to see prominent use in teams, when it could be a primary Berserker closer alongside Disembowel.
The potential of this class feels gated behind being in a team, and that is not okay. We shouldn't be releasing new classes when we can't even make our remakes of classes work. It's not alright for an entire class to lack any potency outside of a team situation. If Berserkers are gods of teamfights, where are they on all of our teams in Imperian right now? More importantly, if their 'team fight god status' is why they can't have their own functioning offense in a vacuum, can we please put that on the chopping block in exchange for a functioning class?