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We're basically agreeing here since I was meaning a raid, not "I want to punk someone who has a monolith who's sitting in Kinsarmar" or the like.
Not sure about that. You shouldn't need to have both the investment in experience and artefacts that I do to go assassinate someone in a city, IMO. That might be an unpopular opinion, but I think it should be doable by anyone with a reasonable amount of game knowledge and a class that makes it viable (assassin, predator, etc). Definitely shouldn't be easy, but there should be a pretty large margin between 'impossible' and 'difficult'.
Full on raid, probably not.
Here is what people are afraid of - and it's also how a lot of hard core PK-ers actually ARE as people, whether they are this candid about it or not. This is the very tail end of a long ring conversation, and it's very relevant this second:If someone breaks the rules, then issue them. Otherwise this is just an implicit personal attack you keep rolling out that PVPers are apparently bad people or something and not helpful to the discussion at all.
Please keep in mind that THIS is how a lot of people think (not just PK-ers, actually, it's just that PK griefing is so much more obvious), and who they are as people, if you're considering allowing them to "make it hurt" to any meaningful degree. If they CAN make it horrible and miserable and griefy and unfun they absolutely WILL.
Thinking about this for a few days, I am pretty sure any kind of system like this is going to end up being a resounding flop.I think what some people don't seem to realize (or don't want to admit) is that for PVP to be viable there must be danger. There is no way to make a PVP system that is "safe". Nor are you going to have a viable system for PVP if they can just stick their head in the sand without consequence.
The problem here is basically that the PvP culture is basically destroyed. There's no feeling of danger. There's no way to be aggressive. There's no way to hit another city and make it hurt. The absolute best case scenario for a raiding system is that it ends up being another minigame that people might play sometimes and that absolutely will NOT change things here.
For shardfalls, I think a 3-man team is a solid start - sometimes just two people, if say, there is just one person in the area to begin with, and you know for a fact that person can whip your **** all over the place, no question. But... to me, there also has to be someplace for that to go, so hopefully, that guy has a buddy he can call in for round two, and so forth. Adds are not all bad, because they can maximize participation, but you (usually) don't want to just nuke people either - not because you're such a nice guy, but because that tends to make people pack it in and go home (or, if they have the people, they'll nuke you back even harder). But yeah, you are definitely going to get jumped (possibly by a good sized team) if you show up at a shardfall. In fact, I've pottered about shardfalls alone specifically so I could get jumped, probably die, and then call in some friends. It's a great way to start a fight sometimes.And yer pretty boned if a shardfall happens in the middle of you hunting the area. I just bounce these days.
I do think the above touches on something really important. I've had people riding me HARD (and I mean some serious verbal badgering and abuse) to go back over and over to fights my side was losing very, very badly, and part of why it was so hard, was because I knew that even the guy "encouraging" me looked down his nose at me and was laughing at me inwardly, so there was no real trust or friendship. I felt I was being used (and I absolutely was).This is a huge turn off for me. Antioch doesn't actually bother me too much anymore but when I first hit aspect it happened a lot and it feels like because I didn't jump in the deep end headfirst with no system I missed that bus. But moreover, speaking from experience running many an org on many a character, pushing people towards RP or towards PK is only going to turn them off it further. People become resistant to it just out of not wanting to be goaded into things. And that's entirely valid. People should be engaging in entertainment media on their own terms.