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Post Classlead Discussion (Dec 2013)

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  • edited March 2014
    There's some major spreadsheet battle going on in this thread...  :bz

    I have some less dramatic things I'd like to suggest but I can't create new reports.  No fun :(
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • Post them here.
  • Summoner
    1.  Enslavery triad: You make up a "triad" of unpacted demons.  You "unleash traid at [target]" to release 1 of 3 of the demons randomly.  Triad cannot include golgotha, dameron, piridon, istria.

    The advantage is that instead of 40 seconds for an unpacted demon, triad has a 10 second unleash.  All 3 demons are put on CD after the triad use.  The advantage/disadvantage is that it improves use of unpacted demons but without giving you full control over them.  You might want to change your strategy depending on which triad demon came out.

    2.  Devil tarot: can be infused and adds taint aura to the target based upon how much mana they are missing.  This would punish people for using focus a lot against a summoner.  Conceivably, it would create a situation where you would selectively turn focus on and off when fighting a summoner 1v1.  Mostly, it would improve taint generation for tarot summoners, and make their damage more consistent.

    3.  Star tarot: THROW STAR OF [card] AT [target].  You can now star tarot afflictions.  You can still deal damage with "throw star of sun" though the damage of the sun tarot might need to be reduced.

    Hunter
    1.  Wyvern claws artifact lets people burrow, if wyverns had burrow the class would have more utility.

    2.  Fear and Claustrophia: Garrynbot and newbie focus make something cured by "compose" sort of pointless (even for newbies) and having claustrophobia without also having agoraphobia creates a strange dynamic where a hunter is stronger in-doors, even though they are a nature-oriented class.
    Solution 1.  Make fear randomly give hidden shyness, claustrophobia or agoraphobia based upon what the target does not have yet.
    Solution 2.  Replace fear or claustrophobia with agoraphobia.
    Solution 3.  Replace claustrophobia with sun-allergy (helps with an out-door theme and the classes' low consistent damage output).
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • These classleads don't really serve to fix any problems, just potentially create more.
  • Et tu, Iluv?

    I'm not sure what perceived problems are or that classleads were supposed to be exclusively about fixing problems.
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • IniarIniar Australia
    edited March 2014
    2. Focus already has an inbuilt cap of 4s and for most classes the mana cost is fairly negligible. To get to mana I'd target something more spammable like clot. To target or slow down focus, a different idea maybe. Iirc summoner already punishes focus via burning nerves. (Correct me if I'm wrong) Also, iirc, infused cards do in the vicinity of 60% of baseline damage.

    3. Star/tarot seems a nice idea until you realize that (that's two tarot) star is physical damage, 0 afflictions. I might as well use an infused spell which gives me similar-ish and scalable damage +-1 affliction. Unless I'm reading it wrongly, then kindly correct me.
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • The idea is you could star tarot an affliction burst by having things like emperor and moon land after a delay.
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • IniarIniar Australia
    Ah
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • No one is stabbing you in the back, Iriaen. We are trying to explain why your ideas about combat in the game would be detrimental to the current meta and that is very apparent that you lack the experience needed to evaluate the current game state and come up with relevant solutions.
  • edited March 2014
    Don't mind me, I'm just making an ides of March joke.

    No one has commented on the triad idea yet.  I've tried to come up with a form of randomness that wouldn't require the class to be played differently since it specifically uses the unpacted demons without requiring anyone to lock them in, so you could ignore the skill entirely if you wanted to, it doesn't let you incorporate the big damage dealing demon, and it wouldn't require much of a different strategy on behalf of the target, but some people would like using it, if even a random skill this is not going to fly then probably no new forms of random skills will be introduced going forward.
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • No, what your skill SOUNDS like it does is get around the opportunity cost model of Enslavery, at the low low cost of 'rolling some dice'.. you know, unless you don't care what the outcome is. For no good reason, even, you ask for this skill. Asking for skills a class doesn't need is a really silly thing to do. What does this ability address? What actual issue in Summoner does it solve that you need this skill coded and put in the game?

    And, no, "Iriaen wants randomness" is not a reason.

    Also, "this game is boring" is not a good reason. Precedence: see Fazlee's last absolve report.

    Solving problematic/draconian/arcane class design problems and new philosophy design oversights.. that is what classleads are for. It is for answering real problems in current combat. The rules of current combat have been laid out.
    <div>Message #2062&nbsp; Sent By: (imperian)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Received On: 1/20/2018/2:59</div><div>"Antioch has filed a bounty against you. Reason: Raiding Antioch and stealing Bina, being a right</div><div>ass, and not belonging anywhere near Antioch till he grows up."</div>
  • IniarIniar Australia
    @Mathiaus, have you tried Wise Bard :D?

    2.73 innyo/nuarinyu
    * 0.8 chi notes
    * 0.85 diadem
    * 0.85 racial

    1.58 eq with chi
    1.97 eq with no chi

    :O -want to try- -still bashing to aspect- -fml-
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • MathiausMathiaus Pennsylvania
    edited March 2014
    I tried it out, but the loss of damage output put a huge strain with killing the target, and didn't see much of a difference with afflicting.

    It might honestly work with enough pressure for We damage though. Who knows.
    image
  • MathiausMathiaus Pennsylvania
    Tried it out again. The first We affliction damage boost is fine, but it's after that that's the problem. Afflicting is definitely better with chi (2.11 without, 1.80 with) but comes at a definite straining cost with resonance.

    Damage in groups is relatively the same.

    image
  • IniarIniar Australia
    Are we going to get class leads any time soon?
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • That would be weird, we're still waiting on a few classleads from last cycle. Looking at you soulstorm, outrider balance stealing pets.
  • 368/512h
    Pellerin has slain Wysrias.
    As Wysrias draws his final, dying breath, you hear him whisper the word, "Vengeance!". Suddenly, a spear of jagged bone materialises from thin air and plunges into your chest!
    214/512h

    What the shit, Wysrias? I didn't do anything to you. 

    Classlead this to be:
    1) slayer only (static or increased damage)
    2) enemies only (reduced damage)
    3) NOT ALLIES OH MY GOD
  • Do you guys still have vengeance-bombing here?

    That is, 3 people with vengeance up and low health walk into a team, and set each other's vengeance off, wiping the whole room?

    It was popular in Aetolia a few years back.
  • The most infamous Vbomb in Imperian history was at a quiz. The offenders were banned from using the skill after that, if I recall correctly.

    They don't happen often here, though. I don't think chain-vengeance is functional, we may have classled it out.
    <div>Message #2062&nbsp; Sent By: (imperian)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Received On: 1/20/2018/2:59</div><div>"Antioch has filed a bounty against you. Reason: Raiding Antioch and stealing Bina, being a right</div><div>ass, and not belonging anywhere near Antioch till he grows up."</div>
  • I would vote for option 1, it's probably the most useful of those scenarios.

    That was entirely my bad! I never play the class and was just like, "hmm, what are all of my defenses" without thinking about the situation. Needless to say, summoner Wysrias is back for awhile at least.


  • VivianneVivianne Atlanta, GA
    Wysrias said:
    I would vote for option 1, it's probably the most useful of those scenarios.

    That was entirely my bad! I never play the class and was just like, "hmm, what are all of my defenses" without thinking about the situation. Needless to say, summoner Wysrias is back for awhile at least.

    Anytime battle occurs, I will put vengeance up.
    image
  • Something Something

    Lyre's of Shallah should have the requirement to be wielded to work. ~Khizan, 2014.
  • Sarrius said:
    The most infamous Vbomb in Imperian history was at a quiz. The offenders were banned from using the skill after that, if I recall correctly.

    They don't happen often here, though. I don't think chain-vengeance is functional, we may have classled it out.
    I think there is a log of that on Nogfx.
  • GabrielGabriel Fort Valley, Georgia US
    Thinking about throwing a classlead into the ring to give druids/hunters the ability to have 2 pets out simultaneously. i.e.

    Pioneering:
    Animal Affinity- Blah blah have two pets out simultaneously.

    I can't think of anything game breaking here, for me it's almost just a QoL improvement, but you guys are better at spotting possible ways that things can be abused. Also, I have no experience with "super pets" and don't know if that could get crazy with those.

    Pets don't get a whole lot of use in a fight because the eq is better spent elsewhere. I'm thinking more along the lines of having a mount and a deliver/vermin/pester pet.

    Maybe even make it a trans Taming skill? Opinions?
    image
  • Doubles the rate of fishing/Doubles the rate of vermin immediately comes to mind.

    I wouldn't encourage a classlead like that because to me classleads are about fixing flaws present within skillsets and professions and not give x profession y because it might be cool and new (and potentially game breaking).
  • GabrielGabriel Fort Valley, Georgia US
    Didn't think about fishing/vermin. Glad I posted.

    I'll settle for my game breaking apple gettin' classlead.
    image
  • edited April 2014
    Sarrius said:
    I still have the log of that. It was to awesome not to keep.


    Banging His gavel, Janus declares that it is time for a new question.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    A spark of magick is nigh imperceptible as it disappears within Trez's body. 
    Soon, his limbs begin to tremble with pained fear, the tremors quickly growing 
    in intensity until he is enveloped by a nebula of multicoloured flame, 
    vaporised by his own magicks.
    Himself has been slain by Trez.
    Trez drops a mortal heart still dripping blood.
    Trez drops a mortal heart still dripping blood.
    Trez drops a maidenhair leaf.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    You gag a bit as Azlyn's stink wafts over you.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Janus blinks.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Dregaur's flesh has decayed into a liquid state and he falls to the ground, 
    spreading into a pool of stinking green liquid.
    As Dregaur draws his final, dying breath, you hear him whisper the word, 
    "Vengeance!". Suddenly, a spear of jagged bone materialises from thin air and 
    plunges into your chest!
    Juganothion has been slain by Dregaur.
    As Juganothion draws his final, dying breath, you hear him whisper the word, 
    "Vengeance!". Suddenly, a spear of jagged bone materialises from thin air and 
    plunges into your chest!
    Dregaur has been slain by Juganothion.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Azlyn has been slain by Juganothion.
    As Azlyn draws his final, dying breath, you hear him whisper the word, 
    "Vengeance!". Suddenly, a spear of jagged bone materialises from thin air and 
    plunges into your chest!
    A masked man has been slain by Azlyn.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Martyn's body disintegrates and a ghostly spirit rises from the ashes. You 
    watch in amazement as the ghost cries out in pain as a body forms around him 
    that has gnarled, decrepit appendages and exudes the fires of the pit and is 
    covered with domed, bald skull.
    Gelf has been slain by Azlyn.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Naomi swoons for a moment then rises again, flushed but strong.
    Krunka has been slain by Azlyn.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Rikarrae has been slain by Azlyn.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Juganothion has been slain by Azlyn.
    You gasp with the realization that Azlyn has reached the level of Transmortal.
    Juganothion drops the Zydramir Journals.
    H:348 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 

    Nathus has been slain by Dregaur.
    You reach over to comfort Nathus as he falls to the level of Lionized.
    H:116 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Drokthar has been slain by Dregaur.
    H:116 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Shylough swoons for a moment then rises again, flushed but strong.
    Ikiryo's body disintegrates and a ghostly spirit rises from the ashes. You 
    watch in amazement as the ghost cries out in pain as a body forms around him 
    that has atrophied limbs and a rotund appearance and is covered with deep green
    flesh.
    Larissa has been slain by Dregaur.
    H:116 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    The last vestiges of strength having ebbed from Olyn's body, he sinks to the 
    floor with a sigh. Suddenly, your surroundings are enveloped in a blinding 
    white light, forcing you to cower with your hands over your eyes. When you 
    tentatively open them once more, you are astonished to find Olyn alive once 
    more.
    Kjorlund swoons for a moment then rises again, flushed but strong.
    Baatern has been slain by Dregaur.
    You reach over to comfort Baatern as he falls to the level of Indomitable.
    H:116 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Erin swoons for a moment then rises again, flushed but strong.
    Pax has been slain by Dregaur.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Anorus swoons for a moment then rises again, flushed but strong.
    Cuyler has been slain by Dregaur.
    You gasp with the realization that Dregaur has reached the level of 5th Circle 
    of Celestial Power.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Rivaidan has been slain by Dregaur.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Northic leaves to the out.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Laia takes a drink from a carved ironwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Risca takes a drink from an elven-crafted vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Olyn quickly eats a quince fruit.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Olyn clenches his fists and grits his teeth.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Olyn rubs some salve on his skin.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Maar takes a drink from a birchwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Brydian takes a drink from a pinewood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Brydian quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> g plant

    A flash of blazing light consumes Ikiryo's body.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Tek takes a drink from a slender redwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    A shimmering translucent shield forms around Laia.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    A shimmering translucent shield forms around Risca.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    You pick up a maidenhair leaf.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Shylough takes a drink from a polished cedar fish-shaped vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Overcome by death, A masked man's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Gelf's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Krunka's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Rikarrae's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Dregaur's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Nathus's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Trez's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Drokthar's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Azlyn's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Larissa's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Baatern's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Pax's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Cuyler's spirit fades to grey.
    Overcome by death, Rivaidan's spirit fades to grey.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Ashel takes a drink from a vial inlaid with obsidian.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> touch shield

    Niara takes a drink from a carved redwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Lepet takes a drink from a vine covered vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Grimoirium takes a drink from a wooden vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Anorus takes a drink from a black and crimson spiraled vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    You touch the tattoo and a shimmering translucent shield forms around you.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Raya empties out a cedarwood vial into her mouth.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Tsinghahla takes a drink from a blackened vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Exavier takes a drink from a vial inlaid with obsidian.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Thante takes a drink from a carved redwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Kjorlund takes a drink from a tusk-shaped vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    A shimmering translucent shield forms around Shylough.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Risca takes a drink from an elven-crafted vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    A shimmering translucent shield forms around Erin.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Seraphina leaves to the out.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Thante appears confused, unable to make up her mind.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Grimoirium takes a drink from a wooden vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Laia takes a drink from a carved ironwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Linden takes a drink from a pinewood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Lepet quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> out

    Risca takes a drink from an elven-crafted vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Laia takes a drink from a carved ironwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    A shimmering translucent shield forms around Hursh.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Brydian takes a drink from a pinewood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Tsinghahla quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Tasalauran takes a drink from a damask steel vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Maar takes a drink from a birchwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Shylough takes a drink from a polished cedar fish-shaped vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 

    Raya leaves to the out.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    You cannot move until you have regained equilibrium.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Thante takes a drink from a carved redwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    A shimmering translucent shield forms around Tsinghahla.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Brydian quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Innan takes a drink from a carved ironwood vial.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> 
    Risca quickly eats a toadstool.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <-b> out

    You have regained your mental equilibrium.
    H:1 M:200 E:1643 W:901 <eb> 
    Ancient remains of a cracked dais.
    The stars twinkle in the clear night sky. A comforting feeling of privacy 
    pervades the area. Northic, Demonwalker is here. Child of the Wood, Seraphina, 
    Wildling of Nature is here. Arcadian, Raya Murne is here. She is holding a 
    tower shield in her left hand. You see a single exit leading east.

  • I believe Trez wanted to make sure he had Vengeance up. But since Vengeance is aggressive, he got zapped. Probably would have finished the rest of us off.

  • It's not really a vengeance bomb if it doesn't crash the game.
  • Iriaen said:

    Hunter
    1.  Wyvern claws artifact lets people burrow, if wyverns had burrow the class would have more utility.

    2.  Fear and Claustrophia: Garrynbot and newbie focus make something cured by "compose" sort of pointless (even for newbies) and having claustrophobia without also having agoraphobia creates a strange dynamic where a hunter is stronger in-doors, even though they are a nature-oriented class.
    Solution 1.  Make fear randomly give hidden shyness, claustrophobia or agoraphobia based upon what the target does not have yet.
    Solution 2.  Replace fear or claustrophobia with agoraphobia.
    Solution 3.  Replace claustrophobia with sun-allergy (helps with an out-door theme and the classes' low consistent damage output).

    wat
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