Cults

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  • ApolocApoloc Member Posts: 241 ✭✭✭
    I'm going to assume there is a bug with the charter system, because somehow I got signed to 'Unity' aka Shallah 2.0, and I would never do this, nor was I drinking.  I was told there were also other out of the ordinary signatures on this charter.  

    My problem now lies that I am signed to a submitted charter, without actually signing the charter, and now Im commited and cannot withdraw because it is submitted.

    Any ideas on this?
    image

  • JeremyJeremy Administrator Posts: 1,110 admin
    edited October 2012
    @Sarrius Are you 100% certain that the cult system is the end? I have posted several times in this thread that once an entity joins a cult, more will be added to the system. Chill bro, chill. I would not replace a full system with ranks, congregations, and more with less features then a clan. We will release the new system in bite size pieces. I want to tweak several small things with the cults already, based on what players are doing, to make them more interesting.

    BathanZiatKhizanKari
  • ZiatZiat Member Posts: 119 ✭✭✭
    I think I'd like to see the cult system get in action first. Everyone is still writing themes and all so I'd prefer to wait with how this goes.

    Its basically a new concept (At least to me) so everyone is excited and started typing CULT CHARTER CREATE HOMMIES. 

    In theory, I think it gives the control of God to players, which I prefer rather then having the game decide for me that these are the options I have. I'm going to wait on commenting till a real cult is actually formed because you can expect a lot of other problems, like Cult Leaders without Entities claiming themselves as God. (Which isn't really a system problem but its going to revive the concept of destroyed Gods) 


    Bathan
  • JeremyJeremy Administrator Posts: 1,110 admin
    @apoloc I will have Garryn look into this.

    Apoloc
  • DelrayneDelrayne Member Posts: 457 ✭✭✭
    Jeremy said:
    Chill bro, chill.
    This is why I love @Jeremy. Of the people! By the People!

  • SarriusSarrius Member Posts: 1,319 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2012
    Jeremy said:
    @Sarrius Are you 100% certain that the cult system is the end? I have posted several times in this thread that once an entity joins a cult, more will be added to the system. Chill bro, chill. I would not replace a full system with ranks, congregations, and more else features then a clan. We will release the new system in bite size pieces. I want to tweak several small things with the cults already, based on what players are doing, to make them more interesting.
    You have, but you are not being forthcoming with details whatsoever. This is the biggest problem I've had for months now - you are not precisely a 'details' kind of guy. You play up the dramatic reveal at the expense of details that make skittish or nervous customers feel secure or comfortable with the system. I have a lot of misgivings that AREN'T 'we lost order structures entirely' - namely how none of the things in the cult system seem to answer the problems we had with the order system. When a god is gone, the organization sits inert without divine assistance. There's no conflict system attached to it (yet, I actually expect you to have accounted for this, so I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here). A lot of the concepts are not suitable for Imperian. We have to wait how long for an entity to like us? It's is a very discouraging system and it feels like it exists for an ulterior motive that isn't 'letting the player shape the world'.

    EDIT: Also, isn't the fact that a lot of people are slapping together charters for old god concepts in a new system sort of indicative of the reception the playerbase has to you killing off their gods?
    Kira
  • SanaiSanai Member Posts: 32 ✭✭
    Setting aside skepticism and forecasts of doom with a chance of gloom, I'm puzzled by the price spike kicking in so dramatically at 3 cults including submitted-but-not-approved. Three per circle is a pretty small number, and a million gold isn't quite as trivial these days as it used to be, much less four million. (And, as we've seen, it's not necessarily a block to really bad submissions anyway.) If it's more about systems of belief than actually having entities, is such a dramatic price spike necessary? Especially if there's ever any culling of low-population/neglected cults, or some method of cult conflict and destruction.
  • JeremyJeremy Administrator Posts: 1,110 admin
    We will cull inactive cults. We will have cult conflict options.

  • KariKari Member Posts: 61 ✭✭✭
    I think I'm going to wait a bit, that's why I withdrew Sicarii. Mostly because I'd like to RP more into making said cult, and to tweak it a bit. I just submitted it first so I wouldn't get hit with a 3 million more fine than to jump in quickly. So I'll see what happens. I still like Apoloc and my Sicarii idea, and have elaborated it more, but I also noticed Freelancers took a bit of our ideals into theirs as well.
  • JorachimJorachim Member Posts: 83 ✭✭✭
    Kari said:
    I think I'm going to wait a bit, that's why I withdrew Sicarii. Mostly because I'd like to RP more into making said cult, and to tweak it a bit. I just submitted it first so I wouldn't get hit with a 3 million more fine than to jump in quickly. So I'll see what happens. I still like Apoloc and my Sicarii idea, and have elaborated it more, but I also noticed Freelancers took a bit of our ideals into theirs as well.
    I didn't realize that's what you did.

    I basically wanted to take the parts of Calix that I liked and grow them more. And twist them. I think I've got a good track on them. I'm actually genuinely working on a full concept for this stuff.

    Which is odd, because usually me trying is "I'll spell check before hand."
    Someone powerful says, "Its broken. No more pulling the guillotine."
    Apoloc
  • ApolocApoloc Member Posts: 241 ✭✭✭
    I loved the Sicarii idea, but well I am unsure about rehashing old ideas only slightly expanding or combining them, I feel its better than lying in the stagnancy of dead gods, but I also want something new and shiny.  I'm not a very creative individual roleplay wise, I'm a genuine follower in that regard.  So I'm hoping something cool comes about, the 'Freelancers' are the most interesting to my taste, though I'm not a fan of the name, and appearances to me are everything.  
    image

    Jorachim
  • JorachimJorachim Member Posts: 83 ✭✭✭
    Apoloc said:
    I loved the Sicarii idea, but well I am unsure about rehashing old ideas only slightly expanding or combining them, I feel its better than lying in the stagnancy of dead gods, but I also want something new and shiny.  I'm not a very creative individual roleplay wise, I'm a genuine follower in that regard.  So I'm hoping something cool comes about, the 'Freelancers' are the most interesting to my taste, though I'm not a fan of the name, and appearances to me are everything.  
    I'm working on a new name.
    Someone powerful says, "Its broken. No more pulling the guillotine."
    Apoloc
  • MkvennerMkvenner Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    I've not played for the last week or so and as a result I've not seen much on the cults so will reserve judgement.

    However from reading this thread, specifically Jeremy's responses, I am encouraged I think. People have always complained about Achaean hangovers, legacy concepts and classes and the like and is a great example of trying to make Imperian more it's own game and furthermore the I like the development ethos that seems to be being presented here.

    I'd much prefer "We'll give you bits in parts tailored to how you want them or use them" to "Here's a system, we'll fix the bugs this month but you'll have to wait years for any real structural changes".

    Also I'd really like to see a cult, along a similar concept to that of the Izzet League from M:tG (even if I am doing Selesnya for standard :S).
    image
  • SigrunSigrun Member Posts: 9
    Why do cults have to be based off of trying to attract a god or entity? :\ I wanna make a cult based off the love of the arena. Rituals before a duel or spar sounds pretty cool to me. Giving other novices a chance to experience the combat in Imperian sounds so much better than trying to follow Shallah 2.0. Alas, my butt ( i don't know if you consider the other word a cuss word lol, and yes, i realise how wrong that sounds. ) is broke, so unless some rich folk picks up the idea I don't see it happening. 
  • SigrunSigrun Member Posts: 9
    double post lol sorry I just thought of it. Fight Club was a 'cult' hint hint.
    Khizan
  • AbigailAbigail Member Posts: 332 ✭✭✭
    The Cult of Robert Paulsen?
    Khizan
  • AhkanAhkan TexasMember Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Cults are what, two days old? Maybe three? People don't really embrace change all that well, so things are naturally going to herp derp around for a couple of days. Of course people are going to cling to what they're used to, it's human nature. Are you really surprised? I think it's pretty silly that a lot of you guys have been spear heading the movement to have a more player controlled, organic experience and now you're butt hurt that it's unfamiliar and hard. All I'm saying is we're really early in the system and I think it's a little premature to start revving up the waaaambulance.

    The buy in is really my only problem with the system. I can get around with four of my friends and make the coven of down voting. The only buy in here is beer and some buffalo wings. If we want to take on more members, buy some air time on the market channel and get ourselves a nice pop up tent from Home Depot, then I can see the justification in charging us some sort of fee that doesn't end in -illion. It's a new system with no promises and no guarantees. I think it's asking a lot to shell out that kind of change for the possibility of a cult considering you just Ol' Yeller'd their gods.
    image
    Lalitana
  • AlarickAlarick Member Posts: 22
    I like the cult idea, but I'm pretty underwhelmed and/or disappointed with most of the AM cults i've seen. I've still got a lot of work to do on my own idea, but I'm alarmed by the gold cost - it's going to take me a very long time to get up to 1 million gold, and I'm not sure that even Ithaqua itself has 4 million. The price seems absurdly steep to me, especially if the cults can be destroyed. Why not just make it easier to destroy them, and let people try and reform if they still have the motivation?
  • AbigailAbigail Member Posts: 332 ✭✭✭
    Who said you had to pay the submission fee yourself? What about the other five guys that signed your charter? Are they contributing anything?
  • KhizanKhizan Member Posts: 2,648 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2012

    One thing I'd really like is, say, a cult based around something like fire worship, for the Magick circle, where there was no actual "God of Fire" or "Entity of Fire" or the like, but where there was still interaction with it. Say, an NPC priest at the altar to converse with and call attention to things when needed, but where the main 'communication' comes from seeing visions in the flames, seeing patterns in the smoke, etc, etc.

    One of my major wants for the Magick circle is an identity that's based around taking power into their own hands. Antioch begs the Gods for assistance with their problems. Demonic controls demons to fulfill their goals. Magick, though, builds a giant contraption out of rune-etched steel and silver and crystal and gold and accomplishes their goals by using their own hands and knowledge to harness the powers of creation.

    However, this kind of thing just doesn't fit well with the idea of entities and that drives me crazy, because magickal mad scientists is such a good premise for the magic circle when compared to, well, basically everything else.

    "On the battlefield I am a god. I love war. The steel, the smell, the corpses. I wish there were more. On the first day I drove the Northmen back alone at the ford. Alone! On the second I carried the bridge! Me! Yesterday I climbed the Heroes! I love war! I… I wish it wasn’t over."

    BathanLionasApolocSarrius
  • AbigailAbigail Member Posts: 332 ✭✭✭
    Khizan said:

    One thing I'd really like is, say, a cult based around something like fire worship, for the Magick circle, where there was no actual "God of Fire" or "Entity of Fire" or the like, but where there was still interaction with it. Say, an NPC priest at the altar to converse with and call attention to things when needed, but where the main 'communication' comes from seeing visions in the flames, seeing patterns in the smoke, etc, etc.

    One of my major wants for the Magick circle is an identity that's based around taking power into their own hands. Antioch begs the Gods for assistance with their problems. Demonic controls demons to fulfill their goals. Magick, though, builds a giant contraption out of rune-etched steel and silver and crystal and gold and accomplishes their goals by using their own hands and knowledge to harness the powers of creation.

    However, this kind of thing just doesn't fit well with the idea of entities and that drives me crazy, because magickal mad scientists is such a good premise for the magic circle when compared to, well, basically everything else.

    Abigail had a clockwork staff once. Like, a long time ago. It was coool.
    KhizanLionasApolocAhkan
  • LionasLionas Member, Historian Posts: 765 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Signatures are definitely broken in some way. At most one of the five names listed on my charter signed it.
    I am the righteous one... 
    the claims are stated - it's the world I've created 
    ApolocDelrayne
  • OzreasOzreas Member Posts: 175 ✭✭✭
    Do these cults come with their own Kool-aid? Otherwise I don't think I'm sold just yet.
    AhkanDelrayne
  • LionasLionas Member, Historian Posts: 765 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ozreas said:
    Do these cults come with their own Kool-aid? Otherwise I don't think I'm sold just yet.
    Mine does! Come sign.
    I am the righteous one... 
    the claims are stated - it's the world I've created 
    AhkanKanthari
  • JuranJuran OhioMember, Beta Testers Posts: 909 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think the question everyone wants answered its this: can I found a religion based on the teachings of Juran?
    Bathan
  • AbigailAbigail Member Posts: 332 ✭✭✭
    How long until the Cult of Mudsex Fertility comes around?
    Khizan
  • AlarickAlarick Member Posts: 22
    Abigail said:
    Who said you had to pay the submission fee yourself? What about the other five guys that signed your charter? Are they contributing anything?
    They're contributing signatures! Only one seems interested in helping me figure out the ideals, so far.
  • BathanBathan Member Posts: 1,056 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Abigail said:
    How long until the Cult of Mudsex Fertility comes around?
    It'll be handled whenever Kaem's active again.
    ‘Least I won’t have to carry it no more. You see how bloody heavy it is?’

    ‘Every sword’s a weight to carry. Men don’t see that when they pick ’em up. But they get heavier with time.”
    Ohm
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